Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Zirrick on Mon Oct 18, 2010 11:35 pm

http://www.mpcforum.com/showthread.php?89622-EVERYTHING-about-GUID-Bans-HARDWARE-Bans

Although PB isn't much more effective at detecting hacks it does do one thing better, disable hackers from using other accounts from the same computer.

This in conjunction with a two-strikes system would work great. If every computer is given two strike's then we'd have less players creating fake accounts to bypass their bans.

Zirrick
Ambassador

Posts : 202
Join date : 2010-10-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Hazarath on Tue Oct 19, 2010 6:44 am

Looks like we have an expert in the house <.<

Hazarath
Good Forumer

Posts : 412
Join date : 2010-09-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Zirrick on Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:35 am

Hazarath wrote:Looks like we have an expert in the house <.<
google works wonders, btw this idea came from the EU community.

Zirrick
Ambassador

Posts : 202
Join date : 2010-10-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by mrfarhan on Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:53 pm

The same community that wanted to use us as ginni pigs? [idk how to spell guenie] xD

Anyways, yes, a more invasive anticheat would work wonders for CA.
avatar
mrfarhan
Good Forumer

Posts : 351
Join date : 2010-10-02

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Gotron228 on Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:59 pm

Zirrick wrote:http://www.mpcforum.com/showthread.php?89622-EVERYTHING-about-GUID-Bans-HARDWARE-Bans

Although PB isn't much more effective at detecting hacks it does do one thing better, disable hackers from using other accounts from the same computer.

This in conjunction with a two-strikes system would work great. If every computer is given two strike's then we'd have less players creating fake accounts to bypass their bans.

The only problem I get with these types of Anti Cheats like Punkbuster is that sometimes they run problems with the user when he or she doesn't even have ANY hacks on hers or his computer.

Although this only happens to me on one game, battlefield heroes, the error code hasn't even been fixed yet so if Combat Arms runs into a problem where most of the players get banned because of their computer and not any use of hacks then it'd turn into a very big problem.

Gotron228
Senator

Posts : 61
Join date : 2010-10-17

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Zirrick on Tue Oct 19, 2010 5:11 pm

Gotron228 wrote:
Zirrick wrote:http://www.mpcforum.com/showthread.php?89622-EVERYTHING-about-GUID-Bans-HARDWARE-Bans

Although PB isn't much more effective at detecting hacks it does do one thing better, disable hackers from using other accounts from the same computer.

This in conjunction with a two-strikes system would work great. If every computer is given two strike's then we'd have less players creating fake accounts to bypass their bans.

The only problem I get with these types of Anti Cheats like Punkbuster is that sometimes they run problems with the user when he or she doesn't even have ANY hacks on hers or his computer.

Although this only happens to me on one game, battlefield heroes, the error code hasn't even been fixed yet so if Combat Arms runs into a problem where most of the players get banned because of their computer and not any use of hacks then it'd turn into a very big problem.

Yeah I get that, but they could/should assign bans like this to hackers in this game. Not necessarily use punkbuster, just make a ban system that sticks. No more 3-4 accounts from the same person just they can have their laughs, and if that account gets framed they can look at a history of where that account is usually logged into. This protects innocent people being hacked, and the rampant hackers we have now. This also punishes higher ups that make new accounts to hack with.

Zirrick
Ambassador

Posts : 202
Join date : 2010-10-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by (MI6) lolpierandom on Tue Oct 19, 2010 7:50 pm

Zirrick wrote:http://www.mpcforum.com/showthread.php?89622-EVERYTHING-about-GUID-Bans-HARDWARE-Bans

Although PB isn't much more effective at detecting hacks it does do one thing better, disable hackers from using other accounts from the same computer.

This in conjunction with a two-strikes system would work great. If every computer is given two strike's then we'd have less players creating fake accounts to bypass their bans.


NUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT PUNKBUSTER Evil or Very Mad

I swear, I got banned on 3 different computers on America's Army because of PB. You know why? I WAS USING FIREFOX *facepalm*

I have a everlasting hate for punkbuster, it thinks anything that isn't the game isn't a hack. I'd rather take Valve's anti-cheat.
avatar
(MI6) lolpierandom
Representative

Posts : 162
Join date : 2010-10-16
Age : 20
Location : On the internet

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by mrfarhan on Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:44 pm

You see, Hackshield now does a really lame job of preventing hacks.
All it does is get the new hack updates, filter out hacks released before the update. New hacks are released within 24hours of the Hackshield update. So for the rest of the month, Hackshield does nothing to prevent hackers.

Zz.

Nexon should just get a better anticheat
avatar
mrfarhan
Good Forumer

Posts : 351
Join date : 2010-10-02

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Slayer_of_1 on Tue Oct 19, 2010 11:12 pm

Let's discuss MAC address bans, which to get around, require the change of PHYSICAL parts of your computer. What do you all think?
avatar
Slayer_of_1
Admin

Posts : 159
Join date : 2010-09-28
Age : 24
Location : Chicago

http://ffca.forumotion.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by mrfarhan on Tue Oct 19, 2010 11:55 pm

It sounds good. But how does it work?

But I don't think many CA gamers will approve of this.
I've heard rumours that some people keep alternates to hack on.
Surprised
avatar
mrfarhan
Good Forumer

Posts : 351
Join date : 2010-10-02

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Hazarath on Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:16 am

Oh jesus D:

Hazarath
Good Forumer

Posts : 412
Join date : 2010-09-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Zirrick on Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:56 am

If we do this kind of hardware ban, we have to add a 2-3 strike system. 1st strike for hacking is a 2 week ban, 2nd strike for hacking gets the account used to hack banned. 3rd strike for hacking gets that computer locked out of CA, permanently. Of course we'll have to add in a system of checks and balances for this system. But as punishments/chances at redemption this system could be effective.

I didn't advocate the switch to punkbuster, just the way the ban-system/ban-types punkbuster uses.

Zirrick
Ambassador

Posts : 202
Join date : 2010-10-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by (MI6) lolpierandom on Wed Oct 20, 2010 5:11 am

Zirrick wrote:If we do this kind of hardware ban, we have to add a 2-3 strike system. 1st strike for hacking is a 2 week ban, 2nd strike for hacking gets the account used to hack banned. 3rd strike for hacking gets that computer locked out of CA, permanently. Of course we'll have to add in a system of checks and balances for this system. But as punishments/chances at redemption this system could be effective.

I didn't advocate the switch to punkbuster, just the way the ban-system/ban-types punkbuster uses.

Then really, we 2 3 strike systems. One for casuals, like say, chams, and the second one for OPK/flyhack ghost aimbot/etc.

First one would be like the one you mentioned. The one for extreme hackers would be

1st. Account Banned
2nd. IP banned(doesn't really work, but w/e)
3rd. MAC banned.
avatar
(MI6) lolpierandom
Representative

Posts : 162
Join date : 2010-10-16
Age : 20
Location : On the internet

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Zirrick on Thu Oct 21, 2010 6:18 am

Hardware bans or work based on the unchangeable serial numbers most computer parts carry, there are ways of changing this, but they are few(I mean like 1-2 programs, and sometimes they can't do it and I've only seen them work on Hard Drives). What this essentially means is to avoid a hardware ban is to literally change the hardware that was used to tether the ban upon it. Most people that buy/download hacks won't be willing to buy a new HD/CPU/RAM chips/any other expensive part just to play a free game. This also means anyone that uses dummy accounts for the hell of it won't be spared. This also means that people will have to come up with rock solid evidence to ban someone. Overall this concept does have its flaws, but the risks involved are COMPLETELY outweighed by the benefits it would provide.

Side-Note: I'm sorry I've been unable to post on the main forums of CA, the forums are showing me actual formatting code (ie:<.p.>I LOVE MAPLESTORY<./p.> take out the periods). Its getting quite annoying, and it takes me 10 more minutes to figure out what the hell exactly I'm saying.

Zirrick
Ambassador

Posts : 202
Join date : 2010-10-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by PopingHeads on Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:43 pm

Slayer_of_1 wrote:Let's discuss MAC address bans, which to get around, require the change of PHYSICAL parts of your computer. What do you all think?
I can spoof a MAC address.

Anyway I always point this out in all threads about a new anti-cheat program.
Just know that no matter what program you use there will always be a way to bypass it, and that people will do it, and they will sell those hacks.

The more I think about it the more impossible this war against hackers seems.

PopingHeads
Full FFCA Member

Posts : 19
Join date : 2010-09-30

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by (MI6) lolpierandom on Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:17 pm

Easy. The best way to counter hackers is to hire FBI agents to track down the IP of every hacker, walk into their house, and smash their computers to bits personally.


Ya'know, just for lulz?

__________________________________________________



Long live MG14c, former great pistoling clan.
avatar
(MI6) lolpierandom
Representative

Posts : 162
Join date : 2010-10-16
Age : 20
Location : On the internet

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by mrfarhan on Mon Oct 25, 2010 10:58 pm

Yup, there are always ways to bypass anticheats but you see, the hackshield we have now doesn't detect anticheats. All it does is update definitions, and prevent older hacks from being used.

Something like scrimspot would be awesome.
avatar
mrfarhan
Good Forumer

Posts : 351
Join date : 2010-10-02

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Zirrick on Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:10 am

true, but really we should have a server-side anti-cheat.
It slows the hackers production speeds a bit.

Zirrick
Ambassador

Posts : 202
Join date : 2010-10-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by mrfarhan on Wed Oct 27, 2010 4:49 am

Yep.

Any examples of games that use them .
avatar
mrfarhan
Good Forumer

Posts : 351
Join date : 2010-10-02

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Zirrick on Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:57 pm

Valve, there plethora of FPS games.
There are hacks developed for them tho, but it doesnt slow the computer down at all. Hackshield & PunkBuster does.

Zirrick
Ambassador

Posts : 202
Join date : 2010-10-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by mrfarhan on Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:25 pm

Hm, a server sided anticheat.

If it's server sided, can it scan your PC for hacks?

avatar
mrfarhan
Good Forumer

Posts : 351
Join date : 2010-10-02

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Zirrick on Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:48 pm

well, the only one I've seen so far is VAC used by valve, operated through the steam client manager.
That one scans for a database of hacks (like hackshield), and modified core files (stuff that the engine.exe uses).

so yes it scans for hacks, and it monitors player behaviors for any suspicious activity.

Zirrick
Ambassador

Posts : 202
Join date : 2010-10-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by mrfarhan on Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:01 am

Makes me wonder why CA uses Hackshield, iwhen VAC is a much much better option.
avatar
mrfarhan
Good Forumer

Posts : 351
Join date : 2010-10-02

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by (MI6) lolpierandom on Fri Oct 29, 2010 2:58 pm

Vac is integrated through the Steam Engine and the steam engine only. Nexon would never give their game over to Valve, since they want 100% control and 100% of the profits from CA.

__________________________________________________



Long live MG14c, former great pistoling clan.
avatar
(MI6) lolpierandom
Representative

Posts : 162
Join date : 2010-10-16
Age : 20
Location : On the internet

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by mrfarhan on Fri Oct 29, 2010 9:02 pm

Then the next best option is something like Scrimspot.
avatar
mrfarhan
Good Forumer

Posts : 351
Join date : 2010-10-02

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Zirrick on Sat Oct 30, 2010 7:24 am

yeah I understood how VAC works, but I'm saying Nexon should create their own server-side anti-cheat. It works great for them (no need for a contract with AhnLab), and great for us (less hackers, more people stay).

Zirrick
Ambassador

Posts : 202
Join date : 2010-10-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Glowingice on Sat Oct 30, 2010 11:17 am

But this way we can't give any1 a second chance :S
Don't get me wrong, I hate hackers, but every1 makes mistakes and they should get another chance
Maybe after second account banned for hacking enforce hardware bans

Glowingice
Full FFCA Member

Posts : 17
Join date : 2010-10-30

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by ElPatron on Sat Oct 30, 2010 11:46 am

Zirrick wrote:yeah I understood how VAC works, but I'm saying Nexon should create their own server-side anti-cheat. It works great for them (no need for a contract with AhnLab), and great for us (less hackers, more people stay).

A NA player has informed us that Nexon had their own tool to work together with hackshield.



But yeah, Nexon having full control over their anti-cheat could be awesome/a fail. Knowing nexon, it would take months to get the system working properly.

ElPatron
New FFCA Member

Posts : 4
Join date : 2010-10-30

Back to top Go down

Re: Brilliance, thy name is "hardware bans"

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum